Thank you for shutting down QO-100!

  • Hi Heiner


    As LEILA is implemented how is it working on QO-100 as last night their was some huge signals well above the beacon levels with no sign of LEILA that I could detect.


    Is LEILA being implemented the same way as on AO-40 with an audible warning?


    73 Keith GU6EFB

  • Hi Thomas


    Thanks for the reply


    The only ref to LEILA for QO-100

    "No uplinks should result in downlink signals that are stronger than these beacons. In the event that such signals are detected, they will be marked by a “LEILA” siren. When they have been marked by “LEILA”, operators should immediately reduce their uplink power (ERP)."


    73 Keith

  • We have to differentiate.

    There are radio amateurs, who send "by mistake" with too much transmitting power, which could call attention to the situation with LEILA.


    But what you can see at the moment on the transponders, NB and WB, are radio broadcaster who definitely do not watch the downlink and in no way know what they are sending out on carriers, impulses, and spikes, in some cases not even on which one Frequency they send.

    And those affected read neither the broadband chat and probably also not here in the forum.



    LEILA does not help either :-(

  • Hi,

    Robert DD4YR, made a point.
    If the offender (let's call it this way) does not read the forum or use the chat pages or webmonitor, LEILA per se will have no affect.

    Anyway, on the WB one offender was allready identified.
    His signal roamed around all of the WB segment, and consequently some part of the NB also.
    I have sent messages to two of his friends (OWU) asking them to assist in this matter.
    Let´s hope that this was the first and last "alarm" on Es'hail-2 ground station.
    Also, I believe that this 2 incidents are related and caused by the same person.

    73 de CT2IRJ

    Salomão Fresco

    Callsign: CT2IRJ

    GRID Locator: IM59re -- CQ Zone 14 / ITU Zone 37

    QTH: Fazendas de Almeirim, Portugal

  • Normally i don't want to discuss this topic. I expected it somehow we will come to the situation as we have now with uncoordinated uplinks. The commercial satellite operators use upc uplink power control to avoid this kind of problems. We got a present to use this really expensive geostationery transparent transponder and have to know the following: Normally there is at the output of the TWT a circulator and load mounted. If you (users) transmit with to much rf power, bad spectrum or out of the frequency range defined by the bandplan rf will be reflected at the small filters (omuxe) and a temperatur raise at the load mounted at the circulator will trigger a warnung and later a alarm. This makes people in the controlroom nervous. There are alot of other effects. The aim is to make you aware its not like shortwave where you can't damage the troposhaere. To learn from this situation for future satellites (if we ever have this chance again in our live) there must be a kind of OBP (onboard processor) implemented. The sw can do a FFT and notch out unwanted signals. Stations with high power won't be downlinked. In germany there are some developments on that. (e. g. google for Heinrich Hertz satellite). But to fly this on a commercial satellite for HamRadio use you need flight heritage and its extremly expensive and normally not reachable for amateurs. Much easier and cheaper is to follow the rules given by AMSAT. Thanks friends!

  • iw6pua Matteo thanks for sharing your observations. But do me the favor and do not blame OMs with their callsigns here. Talk to them directly. and if you cannot do this, give this information to others e.g. by email or local call. Then they can talk to them. I think, this is the better way.

  • I'm not an experienced HAM in anyway but I'd love to make a QO-100 QSO. I'm slowly getting there while trying to build the equipment necessary. But as a SW engineer I'm amazed that a satellite can be launched in this day and age and still be vulnerable to Denial of Service attacks. So a malicious person could with a few hundred of dollars worth of equipment and a knowledge level equal to a HAM certificate can knock out a multi million dollar satellite up-link and the search area for the culprit would be 1/3 of globe with limited possibility of getting caught?


    Please explain to me how the above statements are wrong?

  • All,


    as Achim DH2VA has clearly pointed out: the limit is the beacon level, not higher .... full stop !


    There is no need for higher power. The signals are perfectly clear even 6dB below.


    I do not think that we should adjust the LEILA level to the beacon level as many people
    will just start playing around with it. LEILA should not be used to adjust the own power
    level, it should be only triggered when signals are significantly too high.


    I agree that the LEILA level is presently adjusted very high. Maybe it should be lowered but not
    close to the beacon level. Radio amateurs should be able to monitor their downlink signal and

    and adjust their signals in amplitude and and spectrum quality on their own.


    I also think that we should politely mention to other OMs, when their signal is not clean or too strong.


    If they do not listen, then let us name them also here in the forum. We cannot ignore it.


    Hopefully that will help to get the situation under control.


    It is up to all of us to lead with good example.


    Kind regards


    Matthias


    http://www.dd1us.de

  • I think nobody expected these problems.

    I did.


    Having significant 'hands on' experience with SNG (satellite news gathering) in one of my former lives, and as former satellite co-ordinator of the Dutch government I spoke with several co-workers of Es'hailSat during IBC2018 and IBC2019 concerning 'how to deal with an 'undefined' user group'. They were flabbergasted ...


    I fully agree with the posting of Achim DH2VA. The QO-100 tpx is a gift, something the satellite owner (Es'hailSat) offered us (i.e. the amateur community). In other words, Es'hail-2 is not founded 'for us'. We mooch. The satellite is intended to offer extra capacity for forthcoming global activities (...football) so, it's primary goal is NOT to serve the amateur community.


    Bear that in mind and be humble (<-- also addressing pirates!)

  • Colleagues, with all due respect to you, I want to remind you that you are most likely limited to this forum.

    Most non-Europeans and, moreover, non-German-speaking radio amateurs do not even know about the Amsat forum, about us, and that we are concerned about the interference here.

  • Colleagues, with all due respect to you, I want to remind you that you are most likely limited to this forum.

    Most non-Europeans and, moreover, non-German-speaking radio amateurs do not even know about the Amsat forum, about us, and that we are concerned about the interference here.

    They don't know about the webchats either. It beats me how anyone who doesn't understand German or English get's their information. It must be difficult.


    Perhaps we need to provide the webchats in Italian, Spanish, Russian, French, Arabic etc etc. So, a question. Is it possible to design a char with automatic google translation so you set whatever language to want to chat in and a seemless translation occurs? There will be some amusing "Out of Sight, Out of Mind" / "Invisible Maniac" events I am sure, but it might get the non-English speaking community to join the discussions.

  • I think that the problem is not the presence of different languages on the forum or the presence of a Google translator. (I easily communicate with you through a Google translator) IMHO, the problem is the lack of widespread propaganda of this forum outside the European community. The lack of great interest of the people in attending such events. And most importantly - the lack of culture and HAM-qualification of work on the air. Pirates don't need this. It was at all times in any topic of the use of piracy (gold, books, music, films), and not only in our HAM satellite. For pirates, the main thing is the availability of a resource. And that’s it! The specific mentality.


    The development of technology makes it easy to buy or make "wunder-man/technical genius" transmission equipment. 2.4G is now not something magical or inaccessible. Amplifiers for 100-500W for a certain price are easily available in a wide secondary or black market. There is a resource, there is an opportunity to use a resource - wow-a-la! And what is there? ... Any rules? What for? - “Sneeze at them!” (Ideoma)

  • operators using QO100 do know

    • where to point the antenna
    • which frequencies to use
    • which power is required


    Unless you have very selective reading, it is hard to miss the information about power levels. I don't buy this being anything else but ignorance.

  • Slightly off topic, but on webchats. I read a comments about IRC chats Webchats, there are twitter feeds, shoutbox, etc.


    The wideband chat on https://eshail.batc.org.uk/wb/ gets used a lot by the DATV'ers

    The freenode chat on the NB not seen much activity at all, unless it is all private chats between individuals?

    I am not on facebook yet so can not comment about that, but notice there are a few QO-100 groups?


    It looks like there are many, many ways of getting a message across to potential and current users, I really do not know which is the most popular to visit, but wonder if they all put forward the same message on power levels and spectral bandwidth/purity.


    Adrian